The Bruins' $11 Million Goaltending Question | Ep. 147

0:00 Speaker 1: Hey Bruins fam. This week's episode was recorded last week

0:04 Speaker 1: before the Carolina Hurricanes won their second ever franchise Stanley Cup. Well,

0:10 Speaker 1: we can't say we're Carolina superfans. We were thrilled to

0:14 Speaker 1: see a number of former Bruins win the Ultimate Prize,

0:18 Speaker 1: especially Taylor Hall and Brandon Bussy. This week's topic of

0:24 Speaker 1: conversation around Bruins goaltending is really timely considering Bussy's meteoric

0:30 Speaker 1: rise within the Hurricanes organization. Now, I know you are

0:34 Speaker 1: all well informed listeners, but here's a little reminder of

0:39 Speaker 1: how Bussy left the Bruins organization and ended up in Raleigh.

0:45 Speaker 1: Bussy had started his AHL career with the p Bruins

0:48 Speaker 1: and was a member of the team for three seasons.

0:52 Speaker 1: Like many things in life, timing determined his future career path.

0:57 Speaker 1: In July of twenty twenty five, the Bruins did not

1:00 Speaker 1: make him an offer and to hit the market, where

1:04 Speaker 1: he signed a one year, two way contract with the

1:06 Speaker 1: Florida Panthers. Florida found themselves in a situation where they

1:12 Speaker 1: had to send him down, but because Bussy was and

1:16 Speaker 1: still is waiver eligible, he had to go on the

1:20 Speaker 1: waiver wire. In order to report to the team's AHL affiliate.

1:24 Speaker 1: During that very brief window of time, Carolina snapped him

1:30 Speaker 1: up and the rest is history. You will most certainly

1:34 Speaker 1: hear and read grumblings that Boston screwed this one up,

1:38 Speaker 1: but you have to remember one of Boston's strengths has

1:43 Speaker 1: been a solid pipeline of excellent goaltending. It's been literal

1:48 Speaker 1: decades since Boston has gone seasons with a sieve in

1:53 Speaker 1: between the pipes. There will be criticisms levied at Bruin's

1:57 Speaker 1: management that Bussy was never given a chance or quote,

2:01 Speaker 1: we could have had a cup level guy for less

2:03 Speaker 1: than a million, But those are unrealistic arguments that are

2:08 Speaker 1: likely rooted and misguided bias. And don't think that this

2:12 Speaker 1: is me suddenly becoming a huge fan of management. Please,

2:15 Speaker 1: if you've listened awhile, you know how I feel. But

2:19 Speaker 1: to the point that Bussy was never given a real opportunity,

2:23 Speaker 1: I ask this, when would you have been willing to

2:27 Speaker 1: bring him up? Because when Bussy signed his entry level

2:30 Speaker 1: contract in March of twenty twenty two, the Bruins had

2:34 Speaker 1: the incredible tandem of Linis Almark and Jeremy Swayman running

2:38 Speaker 1: the show back there, so how could you possibly interrupt

2:41 Speaker 1: that chemistry and flow. It was the perfect season. When

2:46 Speaker 1: it came time for Boston to put more eggs in

2:48 Speaker 1: someone's basket in June of twenty twenty four, management chose Swayman.

2:54 Speaker 1: I won't debate that decision now, and I couldn't tell

2:58 Speaker 1: you why management opted to bring in Corpusolo over Bussy.

3:02 Speaker 1: I don't know. There can be many good reasons as

3:05 Speaker 1: well as many stupid ones and mistakes. Regardless, the twenty

3:11 Speaker 1: twenty four twenty twenty five season was a disaster in

3:15 Speaker 1: so many ways. Not one single thing could have really

3:19 Speaker 1: fixed it, including bringing up Bussy. And while bringing up

3:24 Speaker 1: players from the AHL can be a good way to

3:27 Speaker 1: shake things up with the skaters, it doesn't quite work

3:31 Speaker 1: the same for goalies. All the while, more and more

3:36 Speaker 1: goalies in Providence have been clamoring for more attention leading

3:40 Speaker 1: up to the point that he left. Think Michael d

3:43 Speaker 1: Pietro and Simon Zychek. Carolina was incredibly lucky to snap

3:49 Speaker 1: up Brandon Bussy, and he won hundred percent deserves all

3:53 Speaker 1: the flowers. But for Bruins fans, remember just because his

3:57 Speaker 1: name is on the Cup now, does doesn't mean that

4:00 Speaker 1: he could have been just as successful in Boston. He

4:04 Speaker 1: had an unbelievable team in front of him this season,

4:07 Speaker 1: and as we've discussed, the Boston Bruins are nowhere near

4:12 Speaker 1: that good right now. So when you listen to today's episode,

4:17 Speaker 1: save yourself the stress and don't yell at us about

4:20 Speaker 1: Brandon Bussy. We know enjoy.

4:24 Speaker 2: Can you start a podcast with me?

4:25 Speaker 1: Please?

4:27 Speaker 2: I need something to do a drug sit it out

4:37 Speaker 2: in trumble about to the same.

4:38 Speaker 1: Castach today, here's a chance pot right down with goalie Scars.

4:45 Speaker 1: Oh my, one move by the rookie too on one

4:48 Speaker 1: Faster Not moving in with Marsha tounchtime on oil dances

4:54 Speaker 1: in't badcasting right home right away, going to Foster, Notchester.

5:04 Speaker 2: What's that?

5:13 Speaker 1: Welcome in everyone to another episode of Bruins Tape to tape.

5:17 Speaker 1: I'm your host today, Caroline with a K, and I

5:20 Speaker 1: am joined by my fantastic co host Maria from Watertown.

5:24 Speaker 1: Hey Maria, Hello, Hello, how's it going today?

5:26 Speaker 2: My friend?

5:28 Speaker 1: It's going as always and it's a better day because

5:31 Speaker 1: we get to talk about hockey. What can I say?

5:33 Speaker 2: Oh, your favorite position or one of your favorite positions.

5:37 Speaker 1: Absolutely, Today we're going to be talking goaltending and your

5:43 Speaker 1: favorite topic around goaltending, which is how much money do

5:47 Speaker 1: each of these teams have wrapped up in goaltending? And

5:52 Speaker 1: is the Boston Bruins situation worth the chunk of change

5:57 Speaker 1: that our goaltenders occupy? Well? Do you like to stir

6:00 Speaker 1: the pot? What can I say?

6:02 Speaker 2: This conversation is a lightning rod conversation in my area

6:07 Speaker 2: I meant right directly in Boston. It is nothing short

6:11 Speaker 2: of sports talk radio fodder every time the goalie situation

6:17 Speaker 2: in Boston comes up and the amount of money that

6:20 Speaker 2: is allocated to said goaltenders, particularly one young man Jared Simon,

6:28 Speaker 2: when everyone has a variety of opinions on that. All right, So,

6:33 Speaker 2: as wonderful as Tim Thomas was and as spectacular as

6:38 Speaker 2: his play was, he certainly didn't make it easy on

6:42 Speaker 2: expectations and contracts. And listen, I'm of the mindset that

6:47 Speaker 2: do you need really good goaltending? A frigging course, you

6:51 Speaker 2: do because a goaltender when you was Stanley Cup on

6:55 Speaker 2: his own, No, because somebody still has to put the

6:59 Speaker 2: goddamn pop in the net.

7:01 Speaker 1: Yes, Well, one point that I always like to make

7:04 Speaker 1: not just because I'm a fan of goalies, but I'm

7:07 Speaker 1: a parent of a goalie, and this isn't just my

7:10 Speaker 1: random opinion. I know that this is a broadly misunderstood

7:15 Speaker 1: position and the expectations are often not very realistic when

7:21 Speaker 1: you've got people who don't necessarily understand the position and

7:24 Speaker 1: what they're supposed to be doing and what they should

7:27 Speaker 1: actually be able to do. And you know, I will

7:30 Speaker 1: always defend the goaltenders. Can a goalie lose a game? Sure,

7:34 Speaker 1: I'm not saying that a loss isn't ever a goalie's fault,

7:39 Speaker 1: but you have to remember, as you perfectly pointed out,

7:42 Speaker 1: is a goaltender the only reason why they win a

7:45 Speaker 1: game or a Stanley Cup. No, you can't win a

7:48 Speaker 1: game just with one superstar player.

7:51 Speaker 2: You have to.

7:51 Speaker 1: Remember goalies in that same breath that if a team loses,

7:55 Speaker 1: it isn't always necessarily because of the goalie, right. I

7:59 Speaker 1: think the Boston Bruins this year great example, especially of

8:03 Speaker 1: the fact that how many times did we see both

8:06 Speaker 1: of our goaltenders play lights out?

8:09 Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, how many times

8:11 Speaker 2: did we say, if it weren't for them, the game

8:14 Speaker 2: would have gotten out of hand. Or Yes, the goalie

8:17 Speaker 2: gave the team a chance to win, a chance to

8:20 Speaker 2: come back because they were making these saves. Yes.

8:25 Speaker 1: The other point that I would like to throw out

8:27 Speaker 1: there because I think now, granted I don't listen to

8:32 Speaker 1: the Boston Talk sports radio, you do the lard's work

8:35 Speaker 1: in that regard.

8:35 Speaker 2: You listen to that, and sometimes I feel the need

8:38 Speaker 2: to respond to it, folks, when I think the conversation

8:41 Speaker 2: is so ludicrous that I can't stand it any longer.

8:45 Speaker 1: Yes, So, for whatever reason, forever, goaltenders have been paid less,

8:53 Speaker 1: have been valued, like literally in terms of money, less

8:58 Speaker 1: than skaters. And it's not really hard to see why

9:02 Speaker 1: the skaters can have a more exciting game. They score

9:05 Speaker 1: the goals. You have to score goals to win games.

9:09 Speaker 1: I will always make the argument. You can disagree, but

9:13 Speaker 1: I will tell you you're wrong that the hardest position on

9:18 Speaker 1: the ice is the goaltender. It's the hardest position to play.

9:22 Speaker 1: You are the last line of defense. Mentally, psychologically, it's

9:27 Speaker 1: the hardest position to be in on the ice because

9:31 Speaker 1: even if the goal wasn't your fault, because your teammate

9:35 Speaker 1: was in the wrong place and tipped it in. It

9:38 Speaker 1: doesn't matter if the goalie is always gonna take that

9:41 Speaker 1: and shoulder that burden. But regardless, my counter argument has

9:46 Speaker 1: always been to a lot of what the talking heads

9:48 Speaker 1: have said in Boston is you should just pay your goalie.

9:52 Speaker 1: Why are you afraid to pay your goaltender? Is your

9:55 Speaker 1: goalie good, yes, then why not pay them? On Paul

10:00 Speaker 1: are with your top players. If you're one of your

10:03 Speaker 1: best players just happens to be a goalie, why does

10:08 Speaker 1: he have to work for a discount compared to the skaters?

10:13 Speaker 2: And the contrarian argument to that is, in the instance

10:17 Speaker 2: of the conversation, the specific conversation that we're going to

10:20 Speaker 2: be having about Jeremy Swayman and Jonis Corposalo is the

10:25 Speaker 2: fact that the Bruins had been playing this to tandem

10:30 Speaker 2: system for quite some time. Yeah, and pretty much games

10:35 Speaker 2: were being split evenly, right, And so then it comes

10:39 Speaker 2: time for Jeremy Swayman to get his first big deal,

10:45 Speaker 2: maybe his only big deal, right unless the Bruins at

10:50 Speaker 2: some point move on from him, because he did sign

10:53 Speaker 2: a team friendly contract, because I believe that AAV becomes

10:58 Speaker 2: very reasonable were the tenure of that contract. But The

11:02 Speaker 2: issue for him was that the fact and I was

11:05 Speaker 2: in this camp where I was saying, you've only played

11:09 Speaker 2: half the games. I need to see what you do

11:13 Speaker 2: if you're going to be if you're going to be

11:15 Speaker 2: the number one guy, right and you say you yourself

11:18 Speaker 2: have said you want to be that guy, I need

11:21 Speaker 2: to see how you perform, or I would like to

11:24 Speaker 2: see how you perform when you're playing upwards of sixty

11:28 Speaker 2: games or close to sixty games as opposed to just

11:31 Speaker 2: splitting them, and then you can talk to me about

11:35 Speaker 2: what I believe your value is. That didn't happen that way,

11:40 Speaker 2: right because you needed to do something something, a deal

11:44 Speaker 2: needed to be had or this player was likely going

11:49 Speaker 2: to walk away with you getting nothing in return. So

11:53 Speaker 2: I understand the frustration with handing someone eight point something

11:59 Speaker 2: million dollars when you're saying to yourself, what has he

12:03 Speaker 2: done yet to earn that eight point something million dollars?

12:08 Speaker 1: But that's not how sports works.

12:11 Speaker 2: Sports and these contracts work on what is the market value?

12:17 Speaker 2: What has the market value been set out? We've seen

12:20 Speaker 2: it happen numerous and countless times with the Fensman with centers,

12:25 Speaker 2: with forwards, and it happens with the goalies too, right,

12:29 Speaker 2: So do I think that's a lot of money for

12:32 Speaker 2: a goal tender, Yes, But when you compare it to

12:36 Speaker 2: money that's being made by other goals in the league,

12:38 Speaker 2: I'm not going to say that Swiman looks like a bargain,

12:41 Speaker 2: but he's not getting He's not getting the same as

12:45 Speaker 2: some other elite goalies are.

12:48 Speaker 1: Really, what really just drives me nuts about that argument

12:51 Speaker 1: that's being made is, Okay, sure, when he was asking

12:55 Speaker 1: for that money, he'd only played fifty percent, I get it.

12:59 Speaker 1: Who among if you had an opportunity to shoot your shot,

13:03 Speaker 1: why wouldn't you take it? He clearly had the talent

13:06 Speaker 1: and the skills. I don't think that anyone denied that

13:08 Speaker 1: he was even then, particularly exceptional in terms of goaltending ability.

13:15 Speaker 1: And we went from Tim Thomas to touk Arask. We

13:18 Speaker 1: have very high expectations, not just defensively of our team,

13:22 Speaker 1: but of our goaltenders.

13:23 Speaker 2: When you're professing to be a defensive minded, defensively structured team,

13:28 Speaker 2: you better have really good goaltending and you better have

13:31 Speaker 2: really the decore.

13:33 Speaker 1: Yes, you've seen teams that don't have that guy in

13:38 Speaker 1: the crease, even though they have the guys out in

13:41 Speaker 1: front Edmonton Pittsburgh. You still need the guy to get

13:46 Speaker 1: the job done. It's part of the package deal. But okay, fine,

13:51 Speaker 1: I get that. What I don't understand is why is

13:54 Speaker 1: there still this perseveration over the fact that I can't

13:59 Speaker 1: believe he's making that much money. The season after or

14:03 Speaker 1: the season that he signed that deal wasn't good, but

14:06 Speaker 1: the entire season wasn't good, everybody.

14:10 Speaker 2: He wasn't in camp. He wasn't in scraining camp, which

14:14 Speaker 2: that's that is a bit significant. You're not there with

14:17 Speaker 2: the guys. You know, maybe some guys were pissed off too.

14:21 Speaker 2: That could have been some of what fractured that locker room,

14:25 Speaker 2: right or wrong on Swaymen's part or his agent's part. Right.

14:28 Speaker 2: I don't think either side handled themselves well during those negotiations, right,

14:35 Speaker 2: But this is the guy that you all everyone there

14:39 Speaker 2: was no disagreement about the fact that organization wanted Swayman

14:44 Speaker 2: to be the guy, and Swayman wants to be and

14:47 Speaker 2: wanted to be the guy.

14:49 Speaker 1: Yeah. And obviously the reason why this is a continued

14:54 Speaker 1: point of conversation on the Boston sports radio waves is

14:59 Speaker 1: because it's no no, no, it is it is.

15:02 Speaker 2: Look at how much money it couldn't even make the playoffs.

15:05 Speaker 2: Tim Thomas won you a Stanley Cup? Yes, okay, how

15:09 Speaker 2: many fricking years ago was that we're talking about twenty eleven?

15:12 Speaker 2: And he had an out of body experience right, an

15:17 Speaker 2: out of body experience in twenty eleven during the playoffs.

15:23 Speaker 1: It's so on brand for Boston sports talk radio to

15:26 Speaker 1: find a player to make scape go or to bitch

15:31 Speaker 1: and moan about.

15:31 Speaker 2: And before Slayman, it was Tuka Ress who was in

15:35 Speaker 2: their crosshairs. And I had my issues with Tuca, although

15:38 Speaker 2: I will give him credit that when it was time

15:41 Speaker 2: for him to negotiate his deal, he was like, let

15:44 Speaker 2: me play out this season, let me show you that

15:47 Speaker 2: I'm worthy, and he put his money where his mouth

15:50 Speaker 2: was and he got his deal. Now, were there instances

15:53 Speaker 2: where you would say, oh, Tuca, what the hell, what

15:57 Speaker 2: the hell where you do? But to lay all of

16:01 Speaker 2: the blame on the missed opportunities that core of Boston

16:05 Speaker 2: Bruins had on the feet of tukarasp is lazy takes.

16:10 Speaker 1: And that was my whole point about the position is

16:13 Speaker 1: it's easy.

16:14 Speaker 2: It's very easy. You can get all the glory and

16:16 Speaker 2: all the blame, right. It kills. I'm just gonna go

16:19 Speaker 2: off on a tangentcy It kills. It absolutely kills certain

16:25 Speaker 2: members of local Boston sports talk radio to if knowledge

16:30 Speaker 2: when Jeremy Swayman plays well, it absolutely freaking kills them

16:35 Speaker 2: to say he played well, he kept them in the game.

16:38 Speaker 1: Why do you want him to be bad?

16:43 Speaker 2: Good? So they can point their finger and say, see, see,

16:46 Speaker 2: look at this team. They only have a total of

16:50 Speaker 2: eight million dollars invested in goalies. Where you're paying this

16:53 Speaker 2: guy over eight million dollars just for one guy.

16:56 Speaker 1: It's first of all, your money, So who cares?

17:01 Speaker 2: It's not like, can you give a hext other than

17:03 Speaker 2: the fact is I can't say that. I don't. I

17:06 Speaker 2: can't even believe I'm defending them. The only rational argument

17:09 Speaker 2: for that is that you're tying up money in an

17:13 Speaker 2: area where you know you have other needs when you're

17:15 Speaker 2: doing a rebuild. If your roster was all hunky dory

17:19 Speaker 2: and you didn't have significant holes and gaps in them,

17:22 Speaker 2: then I could say, what do you care? It's not

17:23 Speaker 2: your money when you look overall, and we're going to

17:27 Speaker 2: talk about this, when you look overall at how much

17:30 Speaker 2: money the Boston Bruins have tied up in just two players.

17:35 Speaker 2: Then you can say, hmm, this is a problem when

17:38 Speaker 2: you're trying to do a rebuild here, or a reboot

17:41 Speaker 2: or a restart or refresher, whatever the hell you want

17:43 Speaker 2: to call it.

17:44 Speaker 1: So let's talk about the money and the amount of

17:46 Speaker 1: money it's tied up in it. Because one thing that

17:48 Speaker 1: you said before is this concept of market value. And

17:54 Speaker 1: I know this is one of your favorite quotes because

17:57 Speaker 1: it was a dumb ass quote from a stupid young

18:00 Speaker 1: man who have thought he knew what he was saying

18:03 Speaker 1: and he should have just kept his damn mouth shut.

18:05 Speaker 2: And he knows nothing of the world yet nothing.

18:08 Speaker 1: However, just because it was stupid doesn't mean that there

18:12 Speaker 1: was some truth in it. I'm referring to Jeremy Swiman's

18:15 Speaker 1: talking about wanting to reset the goalie market. Now, let

18:18 Speaker 1: me say this first, and you said this, there are

18:21 Speaker 1: times when forward players, especially because they're the highest page,

18:27 Speaker 1: do exactly that they reset the market. I think we

18:30 Speaker 1: all remember. God now was probably about five or six,

18:33 Speaker 1: maybe even seven years ago when I want to say

18:37 Speaker 1: it was Connor McDavid or it was Leandreisidel, one of

18:40 Speaker 1: the first skaters to crack the ten million mark, and

18:45 Speaker 1: that became the line where you identify elite skaters forwards

18:50 Speaker 1: and the rest. Most notably this season, Carill capriz Off

18:56 Speaker 1: has now pushed that line almost to twenty million dollars.

19:02 Speaker 1: He's making I believe here it is seventeen million per year.

19:08 Speaker 1: Full no move. If he hasn't set the new market

19:12 Speaker 1: rate for elite players, he's propelling that new market rate

19:18 Speaker 1: to the twenty million line for any other elite players

19:22 Speaker 1: who are still sitting on old contracts. That's the nature

19:25 Speaker 1: of pro sports. Jeremy Swayman and his stupid youth aside,

19:32 Speaker 1: why can't a goalie do the exact same thing effectively?

19:35 Speaker 1: He has, as much as we don't want to admit

19:39 Speaker 1: that his idiotic comment, We've known for years that goalies

19:43 Speaker 1: have been underpaid for the value that they bring to

19:48 Speaker 1: a team in general. The fact that elite goalies were

19:51 Speaker 1: only making three or four million dollars when you had

19:54 Speaker 1: someone like Connor McDavid making thirteen or fourteen. How could

19:57 Speaker 1: you have such a spread for a position that, yes,

20:01 Speaker 1: I'm gonna say it's the most important position on the ice,

20:03 Speaker 1: but you really can't even compare it to anything else.

20:06 Speaker 1: So why is that one that much less? Since then,

20:10 Speaker 1: we have seen other signings. Now again, you can agree

20:15 Speaker 1: or disagree with the value of those contracts when you

20:17 Speaker 1: hear these names, but it doesn't change the fact that basically,

20:22 Speaker 1: since Swayman got his eight million dollar deal, that is

20:26 Speaker 1: now the new dividing line. That is the new Here's

20:30 Speaker 1: where the elite, Here's where are our the guy is

20:34 Speaker 1: versus not the guy, that's the difference. So you have

20:39 Speaker 1: the most well paid goalie right now in the entire league,

20:43 Speaker 1: Igor Schusterkin. He signed his deal not too long ago

20:48 Speaker 1: for eleven to five. But then also you have someone

20:53 Speaker 1: from Vancouver, yep, Thatcher Demco who is has been tapped

20:58 Speaker 1: as there the guy in twenty twenty six. His contract

21:02 Speaker 1: extension kicks in eight point five. So that's kind of

21:07 Speaker 1: the direction that things are starting to move in. These

21:11 Speaker 1: guys are going to be making more and more money. Now,

21:13 Speaker 1: is it always necessarily wise? That's a different conversation, and

21:17 Speaker 1: I think that it is should be considered independent of

21:21 Speaker 1: at least in terms of the Boston Bruins, independent of

21:24 Speaker 1: Swaymen and Corpus Salo's abilities, at least for this conversation,

21:30 Speaker 1: because we know that they are good players. Let's focus

21:33 Speaker 1: maybe the conversation not so much on I can't believe

21:37 Speaker 1: they have eleven point two five million dollars in those

21:41 Speaker 1: two guys, but rather in one position. And why is

21:47 Speaker 1: that maybe a good or bad idea?

21:49 Speaker 2: I think I think if you gave Don Sweeney and

21:53 Speaker 2: Cam Neely some truth serum, they would have preferred to

21:57 Speaker 2: have moved Jonas Corposalo either in the off season. Well,

22:01 Speaker 2: they couldn't have. They couldn't do it the year that

22:03 Speaker 2: they were negotiating with Swimming, because we would have been

22:06 Speaker 2: screwed and tattooed if that pulled out lasted longer than

22:11 Speaker 2: it actually did. But you have other viable alternatives in Providence,

22:17 Speaker 2: and I think because you had no options between the

22:21 Speaker 2: negotiations and the start of the season that you were

22:25 Speaker 2: boxed in by these two guys. Now we all know

22:30 Speaker 2: that the two goalie system seems to be kind of

22:34 Speaker 2: a Neuveau idea that has taken off, and it is

22:38 Speaker 2: serving teams well to have two solid goaltenders that you

22:44 Speaker 2: can rely on. The question is do you still need

22:49 Speaker 2: an elite goaltender to take you to the promised Land,

22:52 Speaker 2: or at least give you a chance to get to

22:55 Speaker 2: the promised land. I mean, you've got to identify a

22:59 Speaker 2: number one guy, the guy that's going to be your

23:01 Speaker 2: go to guy, the guy that's going to stop the

23:03 Speaker 2: bleeding when you're potentially looking at a three, four, five

23:09 Speaker 2: game losing streak. You want the guy that you know

23:13 Speaker 2: what you're going to get when you're looking at a

23:15 Speaker 2: four or five six game series in the playoffs. Right, Yeah.

23:20 Speaker 2: I think if things had played out differently with Swayman

23:24 Speaker 2: in terms of how the negotiations did or didn't go,

23:27 Speaker 2: I'm not really sure that Jonas Corposalo would still be

23:32 Speaker 2: a member of the Boston Bruins. I'm not sure he's

23:35 Speaker 2: still going to be a member of the Boston Bruins

23:37 Speaker 2: come the upcoming season. I don't think he should be.

23:39 Speaker 2: I think you've got to get that money off your books,

23:41 Speaker 2: ASA sure.

23:43 Speaker 1: Think about it also in the context of looking at

23:47 Speaker 1: other teams with clear starting guys. All right, the Winnipeg Jets,

23:55 Speaker 1: Connor Hallibuch makes eight point five. He played sixty nine

23:59 Speaker 1: percent of the games this past season. Jeremy Swiman played

24:02 Speaker 1: sixty seven percent of the game, So Hellabuk had fifty

24:05 Speaker 1: seven games played. If you also look at Jay Gottinger,

24:10 Speaker 1: who I think is the other big comparable, he's obviously

24:15 Speaker 1: a key guy eight two five, he played fifty four games,

24:20 Speaker 1: So that's sixty almost sixty six percent. Those are your comparables.

24:24 Speaker 2: They're in the window of the ballpark of what they

24:27 Speaker 2: should be making their partner.

24:29 Speaker 1: Let's then think about what their partner is making. Right.

24:32 Speaker 1: So in Dallas, Casey de Smith took on the backup

24:37 Speaker 1: role just a little over a million, and for Winnipeg,

24:41 Speaker 1: Connor Hellibuck's partner, Eric Commery eight twenty five Unics corpus Sollo,

24:46 Speaker 1: he's making three now three million dollars in the grand

24:49 Speaker 1: scheme of things whatever. However, when you have in Providence

24:54 Speaker 1: multiple goalies, the good goalies, when you have multiples of

24:58 Speaker 1: the same thing, either on the team or in your pipeline,

25:03 Speaker 1: why wouldn't you bring in the one that is a

25:05 Speaker 1: little bit younger, So they're going to be cheaper, you

25:08 Speaker 1: have them for longer. You can also simultaneously develop them,

25:12 Speaker 1: and that's what you have, especially in Tpietrow he's going

25:16 Speaker 1: to be coming in and likely forever long. His contract

25:20 Speaker 1: deal is making minimum salary and could potentially provide the

25:26 Speaker 1: same level of play that we saw from Unis Corpusolo.

25:30 Speaker 1: In fact, d Pietro did have his one game where

25:32 Speaker 1: he played briefly and he survived, so that was good.

25:35 Speaker 2: Now, things that I think Jeremy Swayman needs to work

25:39 Speaker 2: on is I would like to see him play more games.

25:42 Speaker 2: I think the issue is when he is playing a

25:45 Speaker 2: significant number of games in a row, maybe his level

25:49 Speaker 2: of play drops off a little bit. That doesn't help

25:52 Speaker 2: the contrarians who are always looking at the eight point

25:55 Speaker 2: two five go and see CC. But I just as

25:59 Speaker 2: a matter of mathematics, eleven point two five million dollars

26:04 Speaker 2: tied up in players who quote unquote are not full

26:09 Speaker 2: time players is a lot. And I think that Jonas

26:14 Speaker 2: is the one. And Jonas has made noise in the

26:17 Speaker 2: fat in the past about wanting to play more games,

26:21 Speaker 2: you know, maybe taking on a more significant goalie role

26:25 Speaker 2: on a team. But I don't think it's sustainable to

26:29 Speaker 2: keep both of these guys. Jonas wants to play more games, Jeremy,

26:33 Speaker 2: you're paying him to be your number one guy, so

26:36 Speaker 2: you've got to give him the net. If he's going

26:38 Speaker 2: to be your number one guy, something has to give here.

26:42 Speaker 2: And I wouldn't be at all surprised if conversations aren't

26:46 Speaker 2: already occurring about moving Yonus pull us out.

26:50 Speaker 1: And if you think about it in terms of what

26:54 Speaker 1: he's bringing to the table, If we go back to

26:56 Speaker 1: the stats, the goals saved above expected, Jeremy Swayman had

26:59 Speaker 1: a phenomenal season period end of sentence, like you can't

27:02 Speaker 1: like independent again he was as a candidate. He was

27:06 Speaker 1: avet a candidate like right least, so you know he

27:11 Speaker 1: had a phenomenal season statistically, regardless of his load management.

27:14 Speaker 1: He had a twenty eight point eight goals saved above expected,

27:18 Speaker 1: and Unis corpus Allo, for as clutch as he was

27:23 Speaker 1: in very key moments, making that timely save in the

27:29 Speaker 1: moment you truly need it, whether it's for momentum, purposes, morale,

27:33 Speaker 1: he had it. He was there. But on paper his

27:36 Speaker 1: goals save above expected was a minus one. He played

27:39 Speaker 1: thirty one games, and he was probably better than some

27:45 Speaker 1: starting goalies, and he could be a good starter for

27:50 Speaker 1: a team that is almost there and needs just a

27:54 Speaker 1: little bit better goaltending. Because look, when it comes to

27:56 Speaker 1: the Stanley Cup Finals, the most elite goaltend doesn't have

28:01 Speaker 1: to be in the Stanley Cup Final, but that elite

28:05 Speaker 1: goaltender is going to get you to cross that line

28:08 Speaker 1: to get into the playoffs and can make a huge difference.

28:11 Speaker 1: And then where it goes from there, that's the final see.

28:14 Speaker 2: And I think that's the argument that crops up here

28:18 Speaker 2: is when you look at the two teams that are

28:21 Speaker 2: in the Stanley Cup Finals right now, Vegas Golden Knights

28:24 Speaker 2: and the Carolina Hurricanes, who don't have this kind of

28:29 Speaker 2: coin tied up in their goaltending. But what people fail

28:33 Speaker 2: to look at is well, what kind of a team

28:36 Speaker 2: do they have in front of them? Okay, exactly system

28:39 Speaker 2: that they're playing in front of these goaltenders.

28:43 Speaker 1: Those are goalies that are good enough, and unfortunately for Boston,

28:49 Speaker 1: as we mentioned in our previous episode, Boston is a

28:53 Speaker 1: ways away at least from having the skating team out

28:57 Speaker 1: front having that level of compete. But again to your point,

29:00 Speaker 1: and I think everyone's kind of on the same page,

29:03 Speaker 1: and granted Corpusolos he's still signed actually shockingly through twenty

29:09 Speaker 1: twenty eight.

29:09 Speaker 2: Yes, so the season two more seasons and then he

29:13 Speaker 2: becomes a UFA. Now I might know, does his contract

29:17 Speaker 2: have any no trade clause in it? Or it does.

29:20 Speaker 1: This was signed when Corpusolo and he was in Ottawa.

29:24 Speaker 1: He has a ten team no trade list, so it's

29:28 Speaker 1: still pretty wide open where he could go. At this point.

29:31 Speaker 1: He's not a player that you are trading because oh god,

29:34 Speaker 1: we got to get rid of him because he's causing

29:37 Speaker 1: damage like Mason Lori. But he's certainly elevated his game

29:42 Speaker 1: and has become valuable in that regard.

29:46 Speaker 2: No, but he could certainly be part of an attractive

29:49 Speaker 2: package to a team who is desperate for goaltender. And

29:53 Speaker 2: I always go back to the Edmonton Oilers and Toronto.

29:57 Speaker 2: Do they have a goal? Not that you want to

29:59 Speaker 2: do an conference deal, but right, right, yeah, but I

30:03 Speaker 2: think we're in agreement that the money is too much

30:06 Speaker 2: to have tied up in two players. Yes, Jeremy Swayman's

30:09 Speaker 2: not going anywhere.

30:10 Speaker 1: And Swayman's not the one actually getting quote unquote overpaid

30:15 Speaker 1: right in this in this example, Yeah, yeah, right, you're

30:18 Speaker 1: just looking at it from a market value perspective. You've

30:22 Speaker 1: got your starter who's making eight across the board, and

30:26 Speaker 1: you've got your backup probably making about one and change

30:33 Speaker 1: at most, which is crazy because we've seen the evolution

30:37 Speaker 1: of how teams are using their goaltenders twenty five years ago.

30:41 Speaker 1: Twenty years ago, you had one guy playing seventy five

30:45 Speaker 1: to eighty games out of eighty two. This coming fall,

30:49 Speaker 1: they're going to be eighty four games, and then it

30:52 Speaker 1: switched to more. We never saw league wide the fifty

30:56 Speaker 1: to fifty. I think that was still pretty unique to Boston,

30:59 Speaker 1: but still doing a sixty forty. And now we're kind

31:03 Speaker 1: of inching more back towards maybe a seventy thirty. And

31:09 Speaker 1: as your starter gets closer and closer to those seventy

31:13 Speaker 1: percent of games, it's not going to make sense to

31:17 Speaker 1: be paying your backup three million dollars financially, it's not

31:21 Speaker 1: going to make sense.

31:22 Speaker 2: It just doesn't. I don't want to say it's a

31:24 Speaker 2: waste of money, but that money could be put to

31:27 Speaker 2: better use in other areas of your roster right now.

31:31 Speaker 1: Yes, anyways, we'd love to hear from the listeners. What

31:34 Speaker 1: do you think an ideal salary matchup would be for

31:39 Speaker 1: or a reasonable expectation is for a salary combo of

31:43 Speaker 1: your starter and your backup because it's changing again. I

31:48 Speaker 1: think in five years we're going to look back and

31:50 Speaker 1: be like, Yep, this was the time when that makeup

31:54 Speaker 1: started to change. And it's interesting because things related to

31:57 Speaker 1: goalies that doesn't change very long. The popular styles of

32:01 Speaker 1: play can change, but what the goalie is doing does

32:04 Speaker 1: not change much. Any final thoughts, Maria, Any additional rants?

32:09 Speaker 2: No, No, I think I've covered what I needed to

32:12 Speaker 2: cover with regard to this specific topic of conversation, which

32:16 Speaker 2: sets me over the edge because it's just an ongoing

32:19 Speaker 2: Let's find the whipping boy, and it's been the mantle

32:23 Speaker 2: and the torch has been passed from Tukarask to now

32:26 Speaker 2: Jeremy Swayman to some degree. Yeap. Frustrating.

32:29 Speaker 1: Nonetheless, until the Bruins win another Stanley Cup, probably every

32:34 Speaker 1: goaltender will go through that experience.

32:36 Speaker 2: Yes, you're likely correct. On that, You're likely correct.

32:40 Speaker 1: Make sure you like and subscribe for more content, and

32:42 Speaker 1: be sure to leave a rating and review to help

32:44 Speaker 1: other Bruins fans find us. You can support the podcast

32:47 Speaker 1: by joining our Patreon or following us on our socials

32:50 Speaker 1: at Tape to Tape MK and on substack at tape

32:53 Speaker 1: to tape mk dot, substack dot com. Any final words.

32:58 Speaker 2: I think that I am ready to get out and

33:01 Speaker 2: play some golf.

33:02 Speaker 1: Awesome. I'm as always go

33:04 Speaker 2: Bees, sober ones,